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Weld quenched with rain water

Posted: 08 Aug 2010, 06:13
by ashfaqanwer
During welding of A-335 Gr. P22 piping, it started raining in the area and two weld joints which were being welded with pre-heating machines attached to them got quenched directly by rain water.
As per my understanding, P-22 is susceptible to cracking upon rapid cooling and with this effect, there is a chance of crack growth in the welds and therefore must be cut.
What do other fellow members say on this?

Re: Weld quenched with rain water

Posted: 08 Aug 2010, 08:34
by arcpro
I agree with your understanding and also recommend to cut out the weld.
But if the weld joint has been completed and can be ultrasonically flaw tested, you must go for it with MT control on the top of the weld joint just to make sure whether there is any crack in it or not. RT would not be reliable in this situation.

Re: Weld quenched with rain water

Posted: 08 Aug 2010, 21:45
by mechcolor
It seems that the welding was in progress and surely the weld joint was not finished yet. Carrying out applicable NDT may or may not reveal cracks for which you would be looking for. Cut the joints, bevel the pipe ends, perform dye penetrant and start welding again.

Re: Weld quenched with rain water

Posted: 09 Aug 2010, 06:38
by ashfaqanwer
Thanks all for the value addition.

Re: Weld quenched with rain water

Posted: 09 Aug 2010, 10:59
by saadsh
I would say that a welder will not continue welding in rain. and sure he stopped and covered the weld.
and since pre-heating machines are attached the harm would be much less.
I would check the hardness and if it is withen normal range, carry an RT or a UT to insure no cracks. and if the joint ok proceed with PWHT.
If hardness withen the acceptaple range after PWHT procedd to final RT. If RT ok the joint is good.
(mostly RT is required before and after PWHT)

Re: Weld quenched with rain water

Posted: 09 Aug 2010, 11:36
by ashfaqanwer
Thanks for adding value.
I truly agree with your approach as it is the right way forward if the welder would have covered the weld properly but in actual scenario, weld got quenched with rain water as rain started heavily. Now what do you say?
By the way, taking hardness of a P-22 weld before PWHT will reveal what?

Re: Weld quenched with rain water

Posted: 09 Aug 2010, 11:57
by saadsh
still if hardness is in normal range before PWHT it will not change my approch. it means the heating machines preformed well and kept a slow cooling. (thats the whole purpose) and the quenching hadn't happened in serious way.
( taking hardness of a P-22 weld before PWHT will reveal what?)
we do the pre-heating and PWHT in order to keep the hadness withen the accepatable range of 2 1/4 CR 1 MO material (P22). if hardness shoot up due to rapid cooling or wrong welding practice/procedure the material may be brone to crack after welding or in service at a later stage.
preheat -> slow cooling -> acceptable hardness after PWHT -> eleminate crack chances in service

Re: Weld quenched with rain water

Posted: 09 Aug 2010, 12:12
by ashfaqanwer
My point is that before PWHT, hardness of any weld in P-22 material is normally not in the acceptable limit (240 HB max.) and then it is brought down effectively by PWHT operation.

Re: Weld quenched with rain water

Posted: 09 Aug 2010, 12:37
by saadsh
So if hardness before PWHT is within that normal range (240 HB) and no cracks presents, the weld is acceptable to me.
in other words the weld was not really quenched. if it was quenched the hadness will be much higher.
the hardness after PWHT would be less than 220 HB for this material if I am not mistaken.

Re: Weld quenched with rain water

Posted: 09 Aug 2010, 12:46
by ashfaqanwer
Hardness below 240 HB for P-22 welds is acceptable.
In my experience, I have never witnessed the hardness of P-22 weld joints below 240 HB BEFORE undertaking PWHT, normally it is in the range of 285 to anything like 300 something and then with PWHT it comes down within the acceptable limit.
Anyway, still value your comments.
Thanks.